{"id":939,"date":"2011-08-12T14:03:30","date_gmt":"2011-08-12T18:03:30","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.mikeneer.com\/lapsteelin\/?p=939"},"modified":"2020-01-16T20:50:11","modified_gmt":"2020-01-17T00:50:11","slug":"frankie-kay-kansas-city-steel-man","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/?p=939","title":{"rendered":"Conversation with Frankie Kay:  Kansas City Steel Man"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_4.jpg\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_4.jpg\" alt=\"Frankie head shot\" title=\"frankie_4\" width=\"272\" height=\"356\" class=\"alignleft size-full wp-image-949\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_4.jpg 272w, http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_4-229x300.jpg 229w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 272px) 100vw, 272px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><em>I am sorry to report the passing of Frankie Kay on January 14, 2019.  My condolences to the Kuebelbeck family.\u2014-Mike<\/em><\/p>\n<p><strong>Frank Kuebelbeck<\/strong> was born before the first electric guitar was ever made, in 1930.  By the time he was in high school, Frankie Kay (as he would become known) was already a bandleader in his native Kansas City, Kansas, playing steel guitar.  In 1951, he was a studio musician at KCMO radio, playing morning shows and then playing 6 nights a week in the clubs, when he was offered the opportunity to join Cowboy Copas\u2019 band in Nashville<\/p>\n<p>When Frank got to Nashville, Dale Potter (fiddle player) suggested he take up residence in a rooming house for Opry pickers.  His roommate was none other than Thumbs Carlisle.  \u201cOne of the funniest things I remember about Thumbs\u2014he played a Bigsby solid guitar\u2014he\u2019d wake me up in the middle of the night sitting in the room in his BVDs just playing up a storm for 2 or 3 hours.\u201d  Thumbs and Frankie became close friends and when Thumbs grew tired of the road work (he was with Little Jimmy Dickens at the time), he called Frankie and was offered a job in Kansas City playing in Frankie\u2019s band.  \u201cWe had a 5 piece group at this Western Swing club and we had all kinds of fun.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI\u2019ll tell you one little story about Thumbs\u2014when he first started, he started on the steel guitar.  He played the open E tuning and he said the bar drove him nuts.  So he pulled the nut off the end of the guitar and he used his thumb.  So, anyway, I said, \u201cCan you still play the steel guitar?\u201d he said, \u201cOh, hell yes!\u201d  My steel guitar friends would stop in to see us and I kept one of my necks tuned to E for Thumbs, and he just played the living hell out of it.  He\u2019d play stuff like Steel Guitar Rag and he played it just as well as he did on guitar.  It would amaze my steel guitar friends.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Frankie worked in package shows while working with Cowboy Copas in Nashville with artists like George Morgan, Ernest Tubb, Hank Williams, Hank Snow, Bill Monroe and Jerry Byrd.  \u201cJerry Byrd, I admired that man so much but he wouldn\u2019t give me the time of day.  He was working with Owen Bradley as studio band man up in WSM.  We were road people and they all worked for WSM (as we did) but didn\u2019t hobnob with the road people.  I was fortunate to know Hank Williams, Sr. and talk to him.  I knew enough about horses to talk breed lines with him.  He was kind of reclusive and just sat over by himself in the corner, but he was very nice and I\u2019d go over and talk horses with him and he\u2019d talk with me as long as I wanted to talk.  And his boys, Don Helms, Cedric Rainwater, Jerry Rivers and Sammy Pruett, lead guitar player, were all friends of mine and were super nice.  But I had to get back to Kansas City and make some bucks.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Frankie went to Riverside, Missouri where a club called the Riverside Rancho was opened and he became the house band.  \u201cMy brother-in-law ran the place and they allowed me to name the place.  When I was with Copas, we went out to the west coast and we just had to see Riverside Rancho, the big place where Noel Boggs, Joaquin Murphey, Tex Williams and all the big boys played. We booked in big bands\u2014we booked Leon McAuliffe and his Cimarron Boys, Bob Wills.  I had befriended Leon when I was at KCMO.  Leon was coming up to Carthage, Missouri and an engineer friend of mine said, \u201cDo you want to go and see Leon?\u201d I said, \u201cI really do!\u201d We went down there and I met Leon and I got to know the band personally by name and, you\u2019ll never believe this\u2026Leon asked me to sit in!  Well, all steel guitar players carry their bar and picks in their pocket if they\u2019re worth a hoot.  I sat in and played a blues and I was out of place as a you-know-what!  But they tolerated me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Curly Chalker is another musician Frank befriended and hired when he was in need of work.  Curly was once asked if he knew Frankie and Curly\u2019s reply was, \u201cFrankie Kay is one of the best steel players in the world.\u201d  Of course, Frankie says it\u2019s not true.  \u201cI became friends with Curly just out of pure guts.  I knew that guy had some talent that I\u2019d never ever seen.  So I went up and introduced myself and he tolerated me.  Next thing you\u2019d know, he\u2019d play himself out of a job and he\u2019d call me up and I\u2019d help him try to find another job.\u201d  Phil Sperbeck, pedal steel player,  was a prot\u00e9g\u00e9 of Frankie\u2019s.  Phil went on to play with Bob Wills.<br \/>\n\u201cAnyway, Curly was out of a job again, I believe 1954, I said come on out.  I\u2019m short one horn man this week. You can work the opposite end of the stage.  He said, \u201cWhat are we gonna do? Two steel guitars?\u201d  I said, \u201cThat\u2019s been going on a long time with the Western Swing bands.  I\u2019ll play it straight, and you just go play anything you want.  And he did.  At this period of his career, he was HOT!  He was a musical athlete when it came to single notes\u2014he would just rip them off\u2014brrrrrrt!  I was in steel guitar heaven.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI\u2019m really a chord man when it comes down to it.  I love good chords\u2014I can\u2019t stand it when somebody plays a wrong one.  I don\u2019t mind alternate chords, but I don\u2019t like wrong ones.  When I started my Western Swing bands, the Country drummers and piano players were too damn dull for me.   They didn\u2019t swing\u2014neither did the bass man.  So I hired a jazz piano player, a jazz bass player and a jazz drummer and we took off.  The rhythm section was just a swingin\u2019 son-of-a-gun!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Frank, you are man after my own heart!  From one chord man to another, I hope I&#8217;m still swingin&#8217; at 81 years old like you are!<\/p>\n<p>*****************************<\/p>\n<p><em>Mike:  You hail from the home of so many wonderful Jazz musicians through its history, such as Lester Young, Coleman Hawkins, Ben Webster, Count Basie&#8211;just so many wonderful musicians\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>Frankie:  Yardbird!  He was a Kansas City, Kansas guy!<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Who was the one who really caught your ear the most when you first got hip to Jazz?  Was it Charlie Parker?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I would say it was a local jazz horn man by the name of Jimmy Keith <em>(note: a member of one of Kansas City&#8217;s superb big bands)<\/em>.  He was a helluva good tenor sax man.  He and I got to be real good friends\u2014he\u2019d be playing in a black club and I\u2019d be playing in a white club and we\u2019d meet after hours and have a drink or go downtown and have a little sandwich of some sort.  He and I just hit it off real good and he steered me toward a lot of happenings and recordings and everything like that.  Even before that, I had a disc jockey friend of mine that turned me on to a lot of jazz and I really hadn\u2019t heard much of the different guys, but he started me out on Red Rodney, the trumpet player.  I thought, \u201cOh hell, there\u2019s a lot more out there that I\u2019m hearing than I know of!\u201d<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_958\" style=\"width: 299px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/Harlan_Leonard_And_His_Rockets_Play_Big_Band_Jazz_sm.jpg\"><img aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-958\" decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/Harlan_Leonard_And_His_Rockets_Play_Big_Band_Jazz_sm.jpg\" alt=\"\" title=\"Harlan Leonard And His Rockets\" width=\"289\" height=\"209\" class=\"size-full wp-image-958\" \/><\/a><p id=\"caption-attachment-958\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Jimmy Keith, front row, 1st on left<\/p><\/div>\n<p><em>MN:  When you first heard it you must have been like the rest of us who just can\u2019t help but wonder, \u201cWhat the heck are they doing?\u201d  Harmonically, it\u2019s just so different, a whole other language\u2014it\u2019s a mystery.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I know it\u2014I did.  I would just grasp bits and pieces of it.  Another thing, Mike, I was lucky that I always had a good jazz piano man in my Western Swing band.  I stood right next to the piano and I really gleaned a lot of the chord formations from him, especially if he was on top of things.  We had a lot of good jazz men that just weren\u2019t doing anything in my early days in Kansas City and I, being a leader, I was fortunate that I could hire who I wanted.  Even though I might have a Western Swing band or a Country type, if I had piano player who was a jazz player, he could play anything.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  I guess that\u2019s the way that the jazz language crept its way into Western Swing\u2014because they would hire players with that harmonic knowledge and they would bring that kind of stuff to the Western Swing.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Absolutely.  Like Tommy Morrell and all of the players he played with\u2014they\u2019re all jazz players with cowboy suits on.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Right.  But I mean you can even hear it in the earliest recordings\u2014little elements of jazz finding their way into the music little by little.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Oh yeah, Bob Wills and Spade Cooley and all those guys had musicians that were capable of playing whatever in the hell they wanted to play. [laughs]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  When you looked at the piano player, you could actually look at his hands and see what he played?  Do you play a little bit of piano?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  No, I\u2019m not a piano player\u2014I wish I were.  In those days, in the \u201850s and \u201860s, we only had one microphone on the bandstand.  It was really primitive.  I would just be close enough where I\u2019d hear all those nice chords that he was playing.  I couldn\u2019t play them, but I could substitute maybe 2 notes out of the chord, or 3 if I was lucky.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  I remember Lee Jeffriess telling me that you had a piano player who studied with Dodo Marmaroso and he was helping you out with some of the voicings and things like that?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, he was very patient with me and he showed me voicings and substitutions and he told me, \u201cYou don\u2019t have to have 3, 4 or 5 notes to make a chord.  As long as you get the voicings right in your lower register\u2026\u201d  I play a lot of 2 string things.  I love the last 5 strings on my E13 tuning.  I\u2019m not one of those steel players who play with the first 4 strings and never utilize the bass strings.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  I think we have a lot in common!  I\u2019m really into playing chords and rhythm stuff on the steel guitar and focusing on the lower register.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, I focused on playing in the lower register.  My tuning is actually E13 tuning, but there are at least 4 different E13 set ups.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  What are the notes in yours?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  The first string is E, C#, B, G#, F#, D, G# and E.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  So you don\u2019t use the B in the lower register\u2026<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  No, and by doing that a lot of times I can start off\u2026I\u2019m hooked up and I\u2019m sitting by my steel\u2014would there be any problem of me showing you what it sounds like?<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Oh, it would be fantastic!<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  OK, I\u2019m gonna be in the key of G and I\u2019ll just walk a G with 2 notes, an Ami7 with 3 notes and Bmi7 with 3 notes and then I\u2019ll go back down. [Frankie plays a walk up through the cycle back to I&#8211;<strong>tab to follow<\/strong>]<br \/>\nCould you hear that?<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Yes, I did.  It sounds similar to the way I like to approach it\u2014you have the 10th interval between the low G and the B and then you played Ami7, Bmi7, Cmi7, Bmi7, Bbdim, Ami7, Ab7.  Excellent.<br \/>\nRhythmically do you like a Red Garland comping rhythm or anything like that?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yes I do.  The way I got to comping was I had a piano, guitar, bass, drums and me.  When I didn\u2019t have the piano player, I started playing the piano part behind the lead guitar player.  I\u2019ll play you a few bars of that if you\u2019d like\u2026.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Sure\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I stay in the same key\u2014I like the lower keys and I\u2019m not one to play up above the 17th fret.  It hurts my ears [laughs].  It\u2019s a matter of personal taste\u2026.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  And it\u2019s a little hard to navigate up there, too.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yes, it is.  [Frankie plays a 12 bar blues using rhythms similar to a pianist\u2019s left hand]<strong>[tab to follow]<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  That\u2019s really wonderful.  I talk about this stuff so much because of all the things I hear players talking about, I don\u2019t hear people talk that much about play rhythm steel guitar.  I don\u2019t mean backup steel where we play high stuff behind a singer, I\u2019m talking about becoming part of the rhythm section.  I\u2019ve written some articles about it on my blog.<\/em>  [For a related article, click <a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/2011\/04\/06\/a-way-to-survive-learn-how-to-play-chord-changes-on-your-steel-guitar\/\"><strong>here<\/strong><\/a>]<\/p>\n<p>FK:  No kidding!  I\u2019m happy to hear that there\u2019s somebody else out there that feels the way I do about it.  That\u2019s great.  <\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  A lot of guys don\u2019t realize how simple it is to change just one note, for instance, in the C6 tuning making the lower C a C#&#8211;sure, you lose the root down below, but you gain so much.  In thinking chordally, it\u2019s a no-brainer.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  The reason I\u2019ve stuck with this E13 the way I have it, I can get a straight chord:  a 6th, a 7th, a 9th, a 3 string diminished and I can get a 3 string augmented with a reverse slant.  Then, when I need it I can throw in a 2 note b5 (tritone).  It\u2019s what you get used to.<\/p>\n<p><a href='http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/fkbm.mp3'><strong>Frankie Kay playing Blue Monk<\/strong><\/a> [For a related article, click <a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/2011\/07\/27\/intervallically-speaking-fun-with-tenths-part-2\/\"><strong>here<\/strong><\/a>]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  You play a double-neck Stringmaster, right?  What other tuning do you use?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, I have a double-neck, but I\u2019ve had 4 necks, 3 necks and then I came down to a double.  At one time I had a combo with a guitar player who had a double neck with bass on one and lead guitar.  And so on my triple neck I had 3 tunings:  the E13, probably an A6 or C6 and then I had bass strings that I bought and I doubled on bass when he was playing lead guitar.<\/p>\n<p>A year ago I went to Joaquin Murphey\u2019s tuning on my second neck and it was C6 with an A9 on the last 4 strings.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  So you had the B two octaves higher for string 8?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, that\u2019s it, but it didn\u2019t please me; it was too shrill.  So I dropped it down to a Bb6 with a G9 on the last 4 strings.  It sounds good, but I\u2019m really not at home on it.  I\u2019ve had it on for a year and I\u2019m still learning.  It\u2019s an experimental neck and I just play with it for fun.<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_953\" style=\"width: 357px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_2.jpg\"><img aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-953\" decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_2.jpg\" alt=\"\" title=\"frankie_2\" width=\"347\" height=\"260\" class=\"size-full wp-image-953\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_2.jpg 347w, http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_2-300x224.jpg 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 347px) 100vw, 347px\" \/><\/a><p id=\"caption-attachment-953\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">From l to r:  A friend, Frankie, Russ Wever, Bill Dye (standing), Lee Jeffriess<\/p><\/div>\n<p><em>MN:  Where did you hear about that tuning?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I think I heard about it from Bill Dye, a friend of Lee Jeffriess who lives in Kansas City.  He\u2019s an experimenting son-of-a-gun.  He\u2019s a very fine jazz guitar player\/blues guitar player; he\u2019d love to play steel for a living, but he has to play with blues and jazz bands on lead guitar to make any bread.  But I got that tuning from him, \u2018cause he\u2019s wilder than anything. [laughs] <\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  That\u2019s what they say was Joaquin\u2019s tuning.  I can hear a few different tunings that he used in different periods.  One of my favorites is the one he used on Spade Cooley\u2019s \u201cDance-A-Rama\u201d.  It was a 10\u201d record with maybe 6 or 8 songs on it.  His playing is out of this world on that one\u2014he started to play more chords.  He really ripped up the single note stuff, too, but he played more chords and added some more altered sounds.  He played with a C6 (high G), but he raised the low C to C# and the low A to A#.  That recording signifies a big change in his playing.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, he was growing up, musically.  Oh boy, I knew there was a lot more to steel when I heard him playing. [laughs]  As a teenager, I heard him playing on the west coast.<br \/>\n<em><br \/>\nMN:  Well, one of the common threads between most of the great players is that they got hip to jazz.  I think once those colors are available to you as a painter, you can\u2019t paint a painting without them.  As soon as you hear those chord qualities, you become drawn to it.  Curly Chalker had those sensibilities, too.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  He was astounding.  I heard him so much growing up and then he worked with me a time or two, although I had to use him on bass because I was playing steel.  He didn\u2019t give a damn!  He wanted to work, he was hungry.<\/p>\n<p>He was a nice guy.  You had to take Curly like he was\u2014he was a genius, but he wasn\u2019t too loving.  Tommy Morrell\u2019s lead guitar player said, \u201cHe\u2019s a wonderful musician and all that, but you wouldn\u2019t want him for a house pet.\u201d [laughs]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Yes, I\u2019ve heard similar things about both those guys.  Neither one of them suffered any fools gladly.  But like you said, there was a lot going on upstairs.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>Curly, as most people know, didn\u2019t have too many kind words for other players, but apparently he did for you\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I can\u2019t believe that he ever said that, because I knew him pretty well.  I liked him, but he never had a kind word for me. [laughs]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  I\u2019m sure that your kindness went a long way with him.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  First time I met Curly I was 19 and he was playing the straight steel then.  He developed into a pedal steel player in his 20s, late 20s.  <\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Did he have all that harmonic sense together back then?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Oh yeah, he was a helluva straight steeler.  Tommy Morrell said that he was the best non-pedal steel player in the world.<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_950\" style=\"width: 511px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_3.jpg\"><img aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-950\" decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_3.jpg\" alt=\"\" title=\"frankie_3\" width=\"501\" height=\"362\" class=\"size-full wp-image-950\" srcset=\"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_3.jpg 501w, http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/08\/frankie_3-300x216.jpg 300w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 501px) 100vw, 501px\" \/><\/a><p id=\"caption-attachment-950\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Curly Chalker, left, on bass, Frankie, center on non-pedal steel, Phil Spurbeck, right, pedal steel.<\/p><\/div>\n<p><em>MN:  You told me Tommy Morrell was your idol\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  He\u2019s my idol, 100%.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  When you listen to Tommy, at times it feels like he\u2019s opening up so many other layers of his playing\u2014he was a deep player\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  One of the things I really like about Tommy Morrell is that he didn\u2019t play a thousand notes per second; he played what I could hear and understand.  Some of these guys that are really hot Nashville players, they just play [emulates machine gun sound].  I can\u2019t get anything out of it.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  I can go either way with that, as long as I feel that, whatever the person is playing, it\u2019s part of what they are trying to say and not just gratuitous.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I admire them and wish I could do that, but my mind won\u2019t pick up on a lot of what they\u2019re trying to throw out at me. [laughs]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Did you start playing guitar first?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I started playing steel, but I wish I would have started on guitar, to tell you the truth.  If I started on guitar, though, I may have never gone to steel\u2014that\u2019s a possibility.  <\/p>\n<p>I had a guitar studio for 40 years and I taught regular guitar.  Anyway, I played a job one night with a jazz snob over in Kansas City, MO and he was a saxophone player.  He said, \u201cWhich guitar you gonna play tonight:  the steel or the real?\u201d  [laughs] That pissed me off\u2014I never hired him again.<\/p>\n<p>I started playing steel when I was 10 years of age.  60 steel guitar lessons, you get a free wooden guitar.  I was the dunce of the class\u2014really, I didn\u2019t take to it too readily.  But my Dad was persistent and he enrolled me in private lessons.  When I was about 13, I started my own group and I had old guys playing with me.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  This is right around WWII.  Were you playing any Hawaiian music?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Yeah, I played some Hawaiian stuff, some Cowboy stuff.  I was lucky\u2014one of my teachers taught all of those good swing tunes, Sweet Sue, All Of Me\u2014the good old tunes.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Were able to tune a lot of that Hawaiian stuff in on the radio?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Oh yeah, and Alvino Rey, I liked him.  He was playing the homemade pedal steel and I loved it.  Boy, he was a chord artist.  And he had a helluva big band.  I liked him and then I gravitated into the west coast players and all that.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  How old were you when you moved to Nashville?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Let\u2019s see, I was about 19 when I started playing 6 nights a week.  I was working at an insurance agency when I got out of high school.  I didn\u2019t want to get a job, but my Mom took me around for interviews and all that.  I was an office boy at the insurance agency and I was also playing 6 nights a week making $90\/wk as the leader of a 4 piece band in a nightclub.  I had to have a special permit because of my age.<\/p>\n<p>After that I got a job on the radio as a staff musician.  So, when I was about 20, the disc jockey and program director\u2014Cowboy Copas\u2019 booking agent was his cousin.  He wrote a letter and recommended me\u2014I wanted to go to Nashville.  I got there and I spent about 9 months and went to the poor house by way of Nashville, because they didn\u2019t pay the guys anything and I was making a couple hundred bucks a week in Kansas City working 3 jobs.  We didn\u2019t make any money&#8211;$75\/wk down there.  I gave Copas a month\u2019s notice because he was really a nice man and a wonderful boss.  I said, \u201cI\u2019ve got to get back to Kansas City and make some money!\u201d  He said \u201cI understand.\u201d  He worked me the whole month!  [laughs]<\/p>\n<p>One of my good buddies in Nashville was Hank Garland.  He kind of moved toward the jazz direction, too.  He used to be lead guitar player for Cowboy Copas before I got there.  Copas always had a good, hot band.  <\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Who was your favorite steel player then?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Leon McAuliffe was my idol at that time.  Besides Leon\u2019s steel playing, he had a helluva good band, the Cimarron Boys.  I loved his orchestrations and everything.  He was a really early steel guitar player playing hot stuff.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  He was a very exciting player, doing it before Speedy and those guys came along.  I think he gets overlooked a little bit in that regard.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I think he did, too.  Boy, those people in Tulsa, OK\u2014when Leon would go on the road, I had a Western Swing band at the Riverside Rancho in Riverside, which is a suburb of Kansas City, and he would call me before his road date and I\u2019d go to Tulsa and play for him while he was on the road.  If you had a steel guitar in the band in Tulsa, you were set.  And I played all of Leon\u2019s stuff, I aped him and loved all of his songs.  He had a wonderful place called the Cimarron Ballroom.  It was an old opera theater and they transformed it into a Western swing ballroom.  Those people in Oklahoma and Texas really know how to dance.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  It seems you really have taken good care of yourself\u2014you have a great memory\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  No, I didn\u2019t, I was just like all the other wild asses around.  I\u2019ve got good genes apparently.  I\u2019m 81 and I\u2019ve been married to the same wife for 59 years.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  You don\u2019t hear about 60th anniversaries too often\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Not very much, especially when one member is a full-time musician. [laughs]<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  She must have an element of saintliness in her.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Well, that and she is powerful, let\u2019s put it that way!  She knew I was in the music business when I met her and she tolerated it.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Do you like to improvise when you play?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I\u2019m an improvising son-of-a-gun, but when you get away from the melody, you might as well pack up and go home.  I like to start off with the melody, like Morrell did, but I\u2019m not satisfied, I like to improvise all the time.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Do you have a certain approach to improvising?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  I think I play off of the chord changes more than I do the melody.  I really don\u2019t like to play the same ad lib every time; I like to expound and play beyond.  I like to play something different.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Well, Jazz is music of the moment, you know\u2014it\u2019s spontaneous composition.  Do you find it hard to find other players coming from the same place?<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  It cramps my style when I\u2019m playing a 3 chord blues and I start to wander off and throw the other guys.  That\u2019s pretty bad.  My favorite player on earth is the bass man.  If I\u2019ve got a good bass man, I don\u2019t need anybody else.  How about you?<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Yeah, I\u2019d have to agree.  I think you can have a steel guitar trio\u2014bass, drums and steel\u2014and it would work great.  One of my personal dream situations would be to play steel in an organ trio, just steel, drums and organ player\u2014someone who played the bass pedals.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Oh, yeah, that would be great.  B3 organ?  I never even thought about that.<\/p>\n<p><em>MN:  Frank, I really appreciate every moment that you spent talking with me.  It\u2019s quite an honor.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>FK:  Well, I\u2019ve enjoyed talking to you\u2014you talk the lingo I understand, as the song goes.<\/p>\n<p><em>Special thanks to Lee Jeffriess, Russ Wever and Nancy Kuebelbeck.<\/em><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>I am sorry to report the passing of Frankie Kay on January 14, 2019. My condolences to the Kuebelbeck family.\u2014-Mike Frank Kuebelbeck was born before the first electric guitar was ever made, in 1930. By the time he was in high school, Frankie Kay (as he would become known) was already a bandleader in his [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[74],"tags":[45,95,22],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/939"}],"collection":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=939"}],"version-history":[{"count":31,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/939\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":2558,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/939\/revisions\/2558"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=939"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=939"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.lapsteelin.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=939"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}